RADIO 3AW DRIVE WITH JACQUI FELGATE

SUBJECT/S: Saints V Geelong on the weekend; Suburban Rail Loop; The Coalition voting against a tax cut; Labor delivering for Australians when it comes to the cost of living; the Coalition’s plan to cut services; Trump Administration; Richard’s snow dome collection.

JACQUI FELGATE, HOST: Joining me from the Canberra studio today, Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Richard Marles and Shadow Finance Minister Jane Hume. Hello to you both.

JANE HUME, SHADOW FINANCE MINISTER: Good afternoon, Jacqui. Hello, Richard.

RICHARD MARLES, DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: Hello, Jane. Jacqui, how are you?

FELGATE: Well, I’m well. The afternoon after the night before.

MARLES: That’s true.

HUME: I was going say the afternoon after the weekend before. Can we please get this over and done with, please? I’m wearing my Saints scarf up here. Richard is very upset.

FELGATE: Oh yeah. I saw photo of you actually wearing your scarf, Jane.

HUME: Yeah, well, I mean, we can talk about it now, we can talk about it later. Whatever you choose, Jacqui.

FELGATE: We’ll talk about it later because we’ve got a few questions to get to.

MARLES: We’re not talking about it at all.

FELGATE: I know. Richard, what I would say was they finished off strongly and that’s something.

MARLES: They did finish off strongly.

FELGATE: Poor Jane always has to listen to us bang on about Geelong. Now, I wanted to start obviously with the budget and the suburban rail loop. Should the Victorian government scrap this project, Richard, particularly in light of Infrastructure Australia’s findings last week?

MARLES: Well, Infrastructure Australia’s findings were that we should– we, the Federal Government should be releasing the $2.2 billion that we committed at the last election, three years ago, which is what we did recently when we talked about this on the program previously. So, that’s what we’re doing. Our focus as a Federal Government is very much on the rail line to Tullamarine. There’s an existing $5 billion there. And then as we spoke about a few weeks ago, we’ve committed another $2 billion to that, which is really in respect of Sunshine Station. And then there’s another $1.2 [billion] in terms of an outer metro roads package. So, I mean the focus of the Federal Government in terms of what we are funding lies there. And we’ll continue to talk to the State government around its infrastructure priorities, but our priority is in respect of the rail line to Tullamarine.

FELGATE: The announcement that was made, or the release that was put out by Infrastructure Australia on Friday was very clear. It cited the need for an exit strategy. It also said that the finances in terms of value capture simply didn’t add up. So, is it financially irresponsible for the Federal Government to put in any more money other than what has already been allocated to this project?

MARLES: Well, as I say, what we’re doing is acting in accordance with the advice of Infrastructure Australia. So, we put in, we’ve released the money that we committed three years ago, but our focus, as I’ve said, is in respect of the rail line to the airport at Tullamarine. And that is obviously an important project. Part of that is Sunshine Station and that’s where our focus is at. You know, ultimately, you know, beyond that- I mean, the State government need to work out what they’re doing. We will continue to talk with the State government, but we are going to be advised by Infrastructure Australia and we’re acting in accordance with that advice.

FELGATE: Jane, can I ask your response to firstly, the findings of Infrastructure Australia, the fact that there’s no money for this project in any of the forward estimates other than what has already been allocated, and your view, if you are to enter government, what you’ll do with the suburban rail loop?

HUME: Well, we want to see the business case. In fact, we wanted to see the business case three years ago and there was none. I mean, this project, as we know, was put together on the back of an envelope. It was put together on the back of a Qantas napkin. And for some reason, Anthony Albanese, who prides himself as being a previous Infrastructure Minister, funded it to the tune of $2.2 billion of taxpayer money. Without a business case, how can that possibly be so? So, we’ve been very consistent with both the Victorian Auditor-General and the Federal Auditor-General on this one. We want to make sure that this thing stacks up. Every bit of feedback that we get is that this is a boondoggle- that it doesn’t stack up for Victoria, it doesn’t stack up for Australian taxpayers. I cannot understand, if this is what is being said, why it would continue to be funded. Where is the business case?

FELGATE: Okay, go ahead, Richard.

MARLES: Well, I mean. I mean, Infrastructure Australia has given the advice that the money that we committed three years ago should be released for that early works. I mean, obviously there needs to be value for money in terms of this or any piece of infrastructure going forward. I come back to what I said. What’s in the budget? What’s in the federal budget in terms of what Federal Labor is funding?

FELGATE: Well, it is nothing for Suburban Rail from the first stage, Cheltenham to Box Hill, Richard.

MARLES: Because our focus is on the rail line to Tullamarine. I mean, that is what we see as being the priority in terms of infrastructure here. And a key component of that is Sunshine Station. But that is where our priority is and that’s what we’re funding.

HUME: Do you know that’ll be the most expensive station in the world–

FELGATE: In the world. More than the one in New York.

MARLES: Well, we need a rail line to Tullamarine. The idea that we’ve got a major airport of a city of Melbourne’s size not serviced by an airport connected by rail to the CBD makes no sense. And it’s been an enduring issue around Tullamarine. This forms part of how you get that rail line there.

HUME: Do you think if it was built without the CFMEU it would be so expensive?

MARLES: That comment right there is Jane’s happy place to go there–

FELGATE: The CFMEU is no one’s happy place.

MARLES: Well, that’s true. Look, I mean I can go into what we were saying last time. We’ve cracked down on the CFMEU actually doing it. But our focus is on that piece of infrastructure. It is important there is a rail line to the airport.

FELGATE: Now, Jane the Coalition has slammed the budget as being a ‘cruel hoax’. What do you mean by that?

HUME: Well, I mean there’s a $42 billion deficit here. Let’s be very clear upfront. After two windfall surpluses, we are now deep, deep, deep in deficit. We’ve officially hit a trillion dollars in debt and at the same time, the government is now spending $17 billion on what they’re calling a tax cut. But let’s be honest, this is simply just an election incentive because it’s 70 cents a day returned to you in 18 months’ time in exchange for your vote. That’s what this is. It is an election sweetener and nothing more. There is no tax reform in here whatsoever. But they’re spending $17 billion even though we’ve got a $42 billion deficit on let’s– essentially, it’s just buying votes. It’s disgraceful. It’s disgraceful. I’m so horrified.

FELGATE: Richard, just could I get your response– you to respond to Jane saying she’s horrified by the budget.

MARLES: Well, firstly, we’re focused on giving tax cuts and so this top up tax cut will mean that for–

FELGATE: It’s five bucks though?

MARLES: Yeah, but for the average income earner, the combined total of the tax cuts that we’ve delivered in the last three years will end up being $50 a week. Now Jane and others can sneer at that if they like, but that’s a significant difference to average income earners. And you know what we saw today in the Parliament was the Liberal Party, the Liberal Party of Robert Menzies voting against lower taxes in favour of higher tax rates.

HUME: But you’re crying about tax cuts that were in the rear vision mirror.

MARLES: That’s actually what happened.

HUME: What you’re offering today and what you’re passing today is 70 cents a day starting in a months’ time–

FELGATE: So, why did the Liberals vote against this?

MARLES: We have put in place, we’ve put in place a series of tax cuts which have given rise to a $50 benefit for an average income earner per week of which this is the last component and right now where the Liberal Party is at is actually voting against that. But here’s the other–

HUME: Australians aren’t that stupid, Richard–

MARLES: But here’s the other point, Jacqui–

HUME: They’re not that stupid.

MARLES: Immediately prior to an election, independently the Treasury, the professionals here do an assessment of the books and if you look at the books as they were audited before we came to power and what they were saying over the period of government that we’ve just governed, we are $207 billion better off than what we inherited from the Liberal Party in terms of the way in which we’ve managed the budget. That’s included two surpluses which the Liberals never achieved in the time that they were in government–

HUME: Hang on, you can’t own the surpluses but disavow yourself from the deficit. You can’t say oh we did that, they’re really good. The deficit’s got nothing to do with us.

MARLES: I’m owning it all. Owning it all. You take the two surpluses and the deficit now which is much less than what was forecast by–

HUME: It’s $42 billion Richard, it’s one of the biggest deficits we’ve ever had on record.

MARLES: It’s less than what was forecast in terms of what we inherited from the Liberals. But in aggregate it’s $207 billion better off that the country is by virtue of the way which we’ve managed the books relative to what we inherited. That that means $60 billion in the decade will be saved in terms of interest payments compared to what we inherited from the Liberal Party.

HUME: You know what’s really scary–

FELGATE: You know what, I’ve got to take a break–

HUME: Is that forecast inflation’s going up.

FELGATE: I’ve got to take a break, Jane. Jane, I’ve got to take a break. You two can argue while we have the break. More after this.

[AD BREAK]

FELGATE: I am talking to Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Richard Marles and Shadow Finance Minister Jane Hume. Jane, I just want to play a bit of audio for our listeners. This is you and Jacqui Lambie on Sunrise this morning.

JACQUI LAMBIE, INDEPENDENT SENATOR: Oh my goodness, I cannot wait to see their Budget reply on Thursday night. What do they become the Grinch, have they? Because quite frankly, let’s be honest, the Opposition Treasurer Angus Taylor has been an absolute train wreck the last three days. Even Sky’s calling it. Seriously, what is in your Budget paper apart from you spending $360 billion on nuclear power plant hat is completely going to blow out of proportion? So, let’s be conservative and say that’s going to cost $500 billion and that is the best plan of attack.

FELGATE: So, Jane, things got pretty heated on the telly this morning?

HUME: Yeah, it was a kind of unexpectedly heated interview that one. Obviously after the budget morning, only the Treasurer and the Finance Minister and the Prime Minister and their opposites tend to go out on television, which is why you see us up against independents who we normally wouldn’t be up against. But it was, it was a very strange interview, to tell you the truth. But you know, Jacqui is a– she’s an unpredictable character.

FELGATE: She got quite emotional when talking about public servants. So, I just wanted to ask you what was that about and why was she so upset?

HUME: Yeah, so Jacqui is very passionate about veterans and always has been. Her concern was that when we say that there are not just 36,000 new public servants, there are in fact now 41,000 new public servants, that’s a 24% increase in the size of the public service in the last three years alone. But it hasn’t been delivering better services. That’s what she was upset about because she’s very concerned about veterans. Now, I did try to assure her that there are no plans to cut anybody from frontline services, that a bigger public service doesn’t necessarily mean better public services. And in fact, what we’ve seen is a falling in the standards of public services. So, for instance, if you want to apply for an age pension under the Coalition, it used to take about 35 days, it now takes about 76 days. If you want to apply for the low income card, it now takes about three times longer than it used to. It takes about 49 days to process a Medicare eligibility and enrolment claim, but it used to be 19 days under the Coalition. So, that’s what I was talking about. But I’m not entirely sure that Jacqui understood that.

FELGATE: Ok, so Richard, is the public service too bloated?

MARLES: Well, I mean, part of those numbers, if we go to Veterans Affairs, is there’s an additional 600 people in Veterans’ Affairs. But when we came to government, there was literally a waiting list of 42,000 veterans who had not even had their claims looked at. What that meant was that people were going on average 200 days before the claim was even looked at. In some cases, it was more than a year. We’ve got rid of that backlog now. I mean, people are having their claims looked at within two weeks. As a result of that, we are actually seeing, seeing veterans use Veterans Affairs and get the money that they are entitled to. And that means that there are more claims coming through. Now Jane’s saying that, you know, backlog’s gone, why do we need those 500 people still? Well, actually, they are fundamentally important to being able to process the claims that are there. And it is a perfect example where there is a frontline service, where this is about veterans getting the money that they are entitled to, having worn our nation’s uniform and having served us in the way that they have, and being owed something back. And this is actually what the front line, what those public servants are doing.

HUME: I don’t have a problem with that. I don’t have a problem with frontline services delivering what they need to deliver. But the problem is we’re also seeing things like the size of the Health Department has increased by about 40%, but bulk billing claims, bulk billing rates have gone down. The size of the Environment and Energy portfolio has almost doubled but at the same time, environmental approvals take forever and longer than they used to. And at the same time emissions have gone up. So, that you can see that a bigger public service doesn’t necessarily mean better service to the public. We want to deliver better service to the public but without that additional cost and let’s face it, those additional, and this was when it was 36,000 public servants who cost $6 billion a year.

MARLES: Public servants provide frontline services. That’s the bottom line. I mean whether you’re looking at Veterans Affairs, when you look at the response to Cyclone– ex Tropical Cyclone Alfred in Queensland, I mean what you’ve got now is a much more efficient response to people in need. The bottom line is that if the Liberals are going to come in, and that is their fundamental about cutting, and really at the end of the day, in order to pay for their power scheme, their nuclear power scheme, cuts to frontline services is what we are going to see. They’ve actually got the–

HUME: That’s, that’s nonsense.

FELGATE: I’ve got to get through a couple of other topics and Richard, I just want to ask you about Signal-gate in the US. Do you use Signal in your day to day role as the Defence Minister?

MARLES: Yeah, look, I do. And we use a number of messaging platforms but what we use them for is kind of commensurate with the classification of the information that is on them. So, to give, to put that in perhaps plain language, if you look at ex Tropical Cyclone Alfred, I had a Signal message from the Chief of the Defence Force about what assets, you know, what helicopters are being used so that I was able to know exactly what was being provided in that disaster relief. I think that’s completely appropriate to be giving me that kind of information on Signal. If we were talking about a top secret classified capability of which we have, there’s no way that any of that would go anywhere near a phone. And so Signal has its use but clearly you’ve got to be careful about what you’re using it for.

FELGATE: Indeed. And just finally you posted on your social media today you collect snow globes.

MARLES: Yes, I do collect snow globes.

FELGATE: You collect debt but you also collect snow globes.

MARLES: I do collect snow globes, yeah. It’s slightly embarrassing. I mean, you get a lot of them. I’ve got about 600 of them.

FELGATE: Is it a bit weird?

MARLES: Look, the collection breeds is the honest truth. I mean once people know you’re doing it, they come back and give them to you. So, I had the Ukrainian Ambassador in. I was rather earnestly showing him my Ukrainian sub collection. I’ve got three from Ukraine which was tickling his fancy and then he’s now posted about that and so that that means more snow domes are going to come in. I like kind of, it disarms people when they come into my office.

FELGATE: Yes, Jane, what do you collect other than wins against the Geelong Football Club?

HUME: I’ve just decided I’m going to give Richard Marles my St Kilda Football Club snow globe.

MARLES: There is one?

HUME: There will be now.

FELGATE: Great to have you both on the program. Thank you.

HUME: Thanks.

MARLES: See you.

 

ENDS